Parthenogenesis

[GameGeeks]

While watching House, I heard this used (as a result of a game he played with Wilson) and so I did some research. Turns out in species, that normaly use XY chromosomes, it's possible for an egg to self fertalize. Some species due this naturaly like ceartin scorpions, lizards, etc. While others it's a freak accident and the chance of it happening is the closest you can get to zero. Though when the process does happen it's always female due to the lack of a Y chromosome.

YouTub video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij7w3s9eoVw) of a Komodo Dragon hatching from a parthenogenesis egg.

A wiki article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parthenogenesis) on it.

And some more info (http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/dp5/sex2.htm) I found on the web.

Also as a safety net I'd like to request this topic locked the moment religion is even remotely brought up. I'm only posting this because science interests me and information like this is highly enjoyable to learn about.

[tatsuya1221]

It seems to be dependent on the type of creature, the more advanced the creature is the less likely it will happen, also....RELIGION!!! *runs*
j/k

Even if you were to try and bring religion into this, it really doesn't matter, the only instance of such a thing like this happening in religious texts, the child is invariably male, and to date no human has had a parthenogenic birth.

[GameGeeks]

That was exactly the thing I was afraid would be brought up religion why hence the warning. But aside from that I love learning how life can develop in unexpected ways.

[tatsuya1221]

That was exactly the thing I was afraid would be brought up religion why hence the warning. But aside from that I love learning how life can develop in unexpected ways.

Well the problem with people is that religions do not have a problem with parthenogenesis, in fact it's said when it does happen that it is the will of god or the gods when it happens, in fact in christianity, it was argued for a while that the being known as the false prophet would have a parthenogenic birth, my point is why would it matter now?

Anyway, i remember that a shark had a parthenogenic birth a while ago near here, i think it was at sea world, not sure.

It does make you wonder if humans are screwing up the environment and causing things like this.
Also the kimodo dragon isn't as big a deal, reptiles have parthenogenic births alot more than mammals, which are very rare.

[GameGeeks]

Yeah, can't find anything on mamals though scientists have combined two eggs using mice. Not exactly the same thing though it's still advancement in a field of research that's not done too often.

[tatsuya1221]

Yeah, can't find anything on mamals though scientists have combined two eggs using mice. Not exactly the same thing though it's still advancement in a field of research that's not done too often.

Well personally i think scientists need to be careful with genetics, lest history repeat.

As for mammals, the more complex the creature, the less chance for parthenogenesis to take place, i think the chance is pretty much nonexistent in humans, last i heard it was 9 to the 850th power.

[GameGeeks]

Yeah, but without research like this we wont find cures for things like genetic deseasies.

[tatsuya1221]

Yeah, but without research like this we wont find cures for things like genetic deseasies.

Genetic engineering in itself isn't bad, cloning, genetic alteration, etc are.

You can study a gene and find what the defficiency is without altering the fetus, and fix it through medication, etc for a short period if you learn enough, the problem is that it is too easy to just alter the fetus instead of cure it.

Then it will get to things like hair color, eye color, maybe even eugenics.

[GameGeeks]

I don't have a problem altering the fetus for medical reasons but for the sake of looks and what not the reprocusions could be desasterous. Change enough and the fetus could become steral.

[tatsuya1221]

I don't have a problem altering the fetus for medical reasons but for the sake of looks and what not the reprocusions could be desasterous. Change enough and the fetus could become steral.

Changing anything in a fetus has a high chance of sterilization as it is, ethics has never stopped progress, the native americans are a good example of what happens when progress is impeded by a group.

Either humanity grows up or it will kill itself.

[GameGeeks]

Yeah, but some things can't be cured outside the womb. Take it out of the womb and the baby dies. Besides we already on occasions do surgery on fetuses. We give them things like steroids if they have under developed lungs. And medication doesn't work for everyone.

[tatsuya1221]

Yeah, but some things can't be cured outside the womb. Take it out of the womb and the baby dies. Besides we already on occasions do surgery on fetuses. We give them things like steroids if they have under developed lungs. And medication doesn't work for everyone.

I understand that, but i'm against genetic manipulation since it will invariably lead to eugenics or "purifying humans".

As i said it has it's benifits, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea all around.

[GameGeeks]

True there's nothing stopping somthing like that but the benifits could out weigh the risks. Plust it's all just speculation right now.

[tatsuya1221]

True there's nothing stopping somthing like that but the benifits could out weigh the risks. Plust it's all just speculation right now.

Well personally the risks are already showing signs of apparency, in china it's actually common for a child to be aborted if it's not a male for instance.

Another factor is making a plague that wipes out people with certain genes, this would be very easy to do now, and you technically can change your genetic makeup after your born, but it takes alot of work.

[GameGeeks]

Guess we'll just see where history takes us.

[linkfan57x]

Genetic engineering in itself isn't bad, cloning, genetic alteration, etc are.


OPINION ALERT!!!!!!!!....i believe that right and wrong are relative here.

Anyway I think that (yes my opinion) genetic manipulation in a fetus is no more wrong than genetic manipulation in a fully grown human....(nanobots anyone?) The only difference is that the fetus doesn't choose it for itself. then again, i'm sure that many fetuses do not choose to be born with birth defects.;)

[tatsuya1221]

OPINION ALERT!!!!!!!!....i believe that right and wrong are relative here.

Anyway I think that (yes my opinion) genetic manipulation in a fetus is no more wrong than genetic manipulation in a fully grown human....(nanobots anyone?) The only difference is that the fetus doesn't choose it for itself. then again, i'm sure that many fetuses do not choose to be born with birth defects.;)

While i agree that gene alteration can be classified as an opinionated topic, general laws of right and wrong are pretty much set in stone, the real difference is how they are viewed by the individual.

[linkfan57x]

if by stone you mean the ten commandments (u probably dont but anyway) thats just one RELATIVE point of view.

[tatsuya1221]

if by stone you mean the ten commandments (u probably dont but anyway) thats just one RELATIVE point of view.

>_<
Please don't try to start something.

I'm basically referring to let's say mother teresa and joseph stalin, both were doing what they believed was the right thing to do, the difference is, they viewed different morals their own way, they are still based upon a basic moral structure.
Mother theresa was striving for a world she thought would be better for the people, joseph stalin's plan was to make a better world for the russian people, basically, the morals are there, but it's up to the people to follow there form of view of it, i view stalin as evil, but i do know why he did what he did was at least logically the "right choice" for the betterment of russia in the long run at the time, but this proves that sometimes The logically good course is not always the truly moral course.

Also, fyi, the ten commandments are arguable for basic human morals, however i have no desire, nor want to discuss that in a topic it has little to do with.
Heck i'm not even christian.

[GameGeeks]

I sai not to bring religion into this at all. I'm officialy requesting a lock.

[tatsuya1221]

Yeah, should have done it before, sorry.